[EDITOR’S NOTE: This interview was conducted by brother Denny with two brothers who worked and are involved with the rural Chinese underground house Churches where God is doing a vibrant work. He has been building a pure pristine Book of Acts fellowship in House Church networks all over rural China. There is a simplicity to the move of God yet such fervency, love, and desire born in the hearts of these believers. We need to break out of the simple 1 hour church meeting patterns, and start to serve the Lord with full commitment like many of these precious brothers and sisters in the Lord. For many of us the questions and truths that are revealed are very important for us to hear as we gather under the Headship of Jesus Christ in local areas. Below is the interview transcript]:
Brother Denny: Let’s move on to another important question. How do the Chinese Christians evaluate American Christianity?
Brother Ren: They feel like the Church in the West is playing games. They are troubled with all the laughter in the meetings. They are broken and weeping in their Assemblies, and we are telling jokes.906 This brings very different results. They feel we are bound by traditions and programs and therefore cannot follow the Holy Spirit’s leadings. We have to make sure we have that direct line to the Holy Spirit and seek to hear His voice. We can never overemphasize the difference between the followers of Jesus in the West and in China. These followers in China hear their Master’s voice, and they follow Him. This is actually a very simple theology.
The Christians in the West have been able to eliminate Christ and His direct presence in their midst. I have a feeling sometimes that the whole Christianity in the West could be going for years before they discover that Jesus has not been with them for a long time.907 He has gone somewhere else. He is not with them anymore.
Brother Paul: The personal message I got from brother Yun is that of Jesus asleep in the boat. His whole point was that so many people in missions, in churches, and in ministries start out with the power of God and great visions. But, then people think, Okay, we can row it ourselves now. Thank you very much. And Jesus goes to sleep in the boat. Great storms arise. They have to wake Jesus up before it is too late to calm the storm.908 Make sure Jesus isn’t asleep in your Church, in your family, or in your life.
Brother Denny: What does the Chinese Church believe about the Holy Spirit? It seems very evident that they are a powerful people. How does this work out in their theology of the Spirit?
Brother Paul: They believe it is God’s command to every believer to be baptized by the Holy Spirit.909 They also believe that we must have continual fillings910 as our life goes on in the Lord Jesus. This is the primary reason for all the amazing things that we have shared in the meeting. Imagine how different the American Christians would be if millions of them would be filled with the Spirit.
Brother Denny: What does the Chinese Church believe about holy living? This is an area of much confusion here in America. The professing church is filled with worldliness.
Brother Paul: They are conservative Christians. They order their lives according to the Word of God. Many do not have Bibles, but those who do study much to see what God says about living a Christian life. Their women are modest, in spirit911 and in their clothing.912 The Chinese culture is different from American culture, but what they wear is modest.
They are all poor, so they have no problems with fashion. This matter of holy living is a real problem to them when they try to relate to Christians from the West. They struggle when denominations try to claim them as one of us, when they are very different.
Brother Denny: Some of the testimonies about healing are amazing. They cause me to sit in astonishment as I hear them. Could you elaborate on the subject of healing a bit more? How often do things like what we heard tonight happen? What is their theology of healing?
Brother Ren: First, let me answer the theology part of the question. They have a very simple theology about healing. They believe that God is a healer.913 It is simply one of the many manifestations of His holy character. In America, you believe that God can heal. In China, they believe He does all the time. It is according to your faith and ours. You receive what you believe. The people are poor and cannot afford to go to the doctor. Because of this, they have to trust in God in ways that American’s do not. Healings happen all the time, but people also have sickness that they have to deal with. Poverty and persecution brings extra hardships upon them, and thus they get sick more often. Sometimes God heals, and sometimes He does not. God is sovereign.914
Brother Denny: Could you also comment on some of the other miracles that you share tonight? It is hard for us to relate to so many supernatural happenings. How does this affect the Church there?
Brother Paul: They believe in a miracle working God. At first, in the beginning of the revival, everyone was astonished as well. As God began to work many miracles, the Church just began to expect miracles. It is not a distraction as it is in the West. Miracles happen at a meeting, and the preacher just goes right on preaching the Gospel. There is an expectation that God will confirm His Word with miracles.915 Eighty percent of the Church has experienced miracles of some sort or another. Because of this, they expect them. They never glorify the miracles; they glorify God. The gift of miracles is in the Bible, and God works through this gift to honor His Name.
Brother Denny: Have you ever heard of someone being raised from the dead?
Brother Ren: Oh yes, it happens quite often. Many times when someone is killed, or dies from persecution, the leaders will go where the body is to pray and find out if God would have the person live again.
Brother Denny: I have often said in my preaching, “When persecution comes, true unity will come with it, because there will be no mixture with the world.” In light of this, what do they believe about unity? We have all this ecumenical confusion here in our land.
Brother Paul: Again, their theology is very simple. Their unity is based on the essentials of the faith and true marks of discipleship. They say, “Disciples witness, and are persecuted because they witness.”
This is where the lines of unity are drawn. There are differences among them, but they do not allow these to divide them in the war for souls. They believe there is more that unifies them than there is that separates them.
Brother Denny: Could you comment on the name given to these Chinese Christians. I am referring to the name house Churches. What is the significance of this name?
Brother Ren: The name signifies several different things. First, the name is given because they meet in houses. There are several reasons for this, and I will comment on them in a moment. The second reason has to do with a distinction between them and the registered churches, which meet in buildings. The last reason is the most important one, they call themselves house Churches out of conviction. They meet in homes because they believe it is more Biblical.916 It is also true that they have to because of persecution, but the primary reason is evangelical in nature. Even if the government of China allowed them liberty to meet openly, they would still meet in houses. Meeting in homes is one of the greatest keys to the tremendous growth of the Church. The more meeting places, the more they can win the lost to Christ. In addition, when they meet in houses, it does not cost them any money. Finances often slow Church growth.
Brother Denny: Could you tell me what the Church services are like when they meet together and feel free? I know there are times when they have to be quiet, but what is it like when they are free?
Brother Ren: The Chinese Christians are a lively, responsive congregation when they gather in freedom. They sing some hymns and some choruses, and the singing is wholehearted. During the preaching and open testimonies, there are lots of amens and hallelujahs. They meet in forests and caves to do this so they will not be heard.917
Brother Denny: You mentioned in your presentation that revival has been continuing for decades. Can you give me some reasons why it does not grow cold or stop?
Brother Paul: As I see it, there are two reasons. First, the Church is busy fulfilling God’s purposes for it on the earth. That purpose is evangelism. As God’s people do His work, He continues to pour out His Spirit upon them. This is a secret to ongoing revival. The Chinese Church has a powerful vision of the Great Commission.918 They believe it is the Church’s responsibility to preach the Gospel to their generation.919 The second reason flows out of the first.
Because of their persistence in preaching the Gospel, they are persecuted repeatedly. This persecution brings purifying, and that brings more anointing. These two work together to create an atmosphere of revival.
Brother Ren: There is another reason why they still have revival. The Church leaders are careful to give the Holy Spirit His place in directing the work. They allow God’s Spirit free course to move how and where He will. They see the American church as one that is too organized. The leaders have a saying about revival that I feel is helpful. They call it, How to kill a revival.
- Man wants to organize it to suit his understanding.
- Then after he has it organized, he then secures himself a position in it.
- Once this is done, the Spirit is grieved, and slowly withdraws.
- Then the Revival becomes a history class, and everyone talks about it in the past.
Brother Denny: Could you comment on the eschatology of the house Churches? What is their end time theology?
Brother Paul: Their theology is again very simple. They believe that Jesus Christ is coming again. He is coming for His Bride who has made herself ready. As far as the details of how all this will happen, there are some differences. These differences do not divide them. The strongest point of their theology has to do with evangelism.
They believe the Gospel must be preached among all nations, and then shall the end come. They get this from Matthew 24.920 Because of this belief, they have strong convictions about evangelism. They believe that if you are not actively busy preaching to others, you are hindering the second coming of Christ, and you need to repent.
Brother Denny: For my last question, let’s talk a little about the leaders of this movement. The Church is growing at a very fast rate, and yet it is underground. Therefore, it would be hard to give much formal training to the leaders. From an American perspective, many would believe you cannot lead a Church until you have had much formal training. Obviously, this training is not happening in China, yet the Church is thriving. How can this be? Can you explain some of preparations the leaders receive?
Brother Ren: Most of the top leaders are very poor. The strongest point of their character is love. They pour out their lives for the persecuted sheep in China both in labors and by subjecting themselves to the dangers of imprisonment. One wrong move and they sit in a prison cell for five or ten years. This is love as many in America have never known. They do train their leaders. The training, however, is very simple. They train them in three major areas. Let me state them briefly.
- They teach them how to be a disciple of Jesus Christ and walk with Him daily. Then from that walk, they must learn how to witness for Christ in a dangerous hostile environment.
- They teach them how to die daily921 and how to die really. These are both very important because of the persecutions leaders face.
- They teach them how to escape the police when they are caught, and how to escape from prison if God says Run.
The Word of God is very important to these leaders. They have memorized and internalized many chapters of the Bible. They cannot carry a Bible around in their hands, so they make sure that they can carry one in their heart. The fire of the Holy Spirit is also very important in ministry.922 These men are constantly being empowered by the Spirit. This is leadership in China, and this is how the Church spreads so rapidly.
Brother Denny: Thank you for taking the time to share with me. I am deeply challenged by the answers to my questions. I know the hearts of the people who will read this article. They will be thrilled and humbled by our Chinese brethren. May God help us. We lack in so many of these areas, but we want to change.
This concludes the interview about the Chinese house Churches. What can I say? Zion in America must reckon with Zion in China. “This God is our God for ever and ever.”923 When Communism closed the doors to China in 1949, there were one million believers in China. Now, fifty years later, there are eighty-million disciples of Jesus Christ. There are also many true Christians in the registered churches. Christ is building His Church in China, and the gates of hell are not prevailing against her.924 Praise ye the Lord. Dear brothers and sisters, let us repent of our lukewarmness925 and unbelief926 and let us believe God for mighty things. The persecution will come. Most Christians in America acknowledge this. We need to get prepared.